Sunday, August 15, 2010

Comments on gay marriage ruling in California

I've been reading a lot of Christian responses to the gay marriage ruling in California, and have a few points I'd like to make.  For anybody who doesn't know, a judge recently ruled to overturn the ban on same-sex marriage that the voters of California narrowly approved in the 2008 election.  The Christians are screaming about it.  Here are my comments:

1. The US has never been at the leading edge of civil rights.  They were not leaders in getting rid of slavery, not leaders in allowing women to vote, not leaders in eliminating segregation, etc.  They are, once again, not leaders on the gay marriage issue.

2.  American Christians want you to believe that gay marriage will be the downfall of society.  There are several countries where gay marriage has been legal for a while, and nothing bad has happened yet.  They ignore this fact as easily as they ignore scientific facts.

3.  There are those who are arguing that because the people voted 52% in favour of the ban, that it should stand, regardless of what a judge thinks.  I'd say they should be careful of what they say now because the trend is changing rapidly.  What do you think the results of a similar referendum would have been 30 years ago?   Does anybody think that 48% of voters would have voted to allow gay marriage at that time?  I think not.  Young people are more tolerant, and older generations are dying off.  It's only a matter of a little time, maybe as little as 5 years, before the results would swing the other way.  If it's then put to another referendum and gay marriage is legalised, would the Christians then scream that the voice of the people matters the most?  Again, I think not.  Their agenda is not about any kind of democratic ideal, it's about their ancient book.  Also, it's strange that all of the negative TV coverage I've seen makes a really strong point about the 7 million voters who voted for the ban, but not a single one made even a single mention of the 6.4 million people who voted against it.  They want to subtly make ignorant people think that the vote was overwhelming, or that very few people voted against the ban.

4.  A lot of Americans are really bad at civics.  The US is not a democracy, it is a constitutional democratic republic.  They have no idea how their laws or government work.  What are they teaching in American schools?  These people are uneducated.  I'm not American, but even I understand this much better than they do.  You cannot override the US constitution with a simple majority vote of the population.  I've seen a lot of angry people accusing the judge of thinking he's more important than the 7 MILLION people (see point #3) who voted for the ban.  No, the judge doesn't think that.  But he is smarter than them, and does understand more about law than they do.  They were voting on a measure which, in the judge's ruling, was determined to be against the constitution.  It doesn't matter how many people voted against it.  There is a very different process for amending the constitution, and California Proposition 8 was not it.  There will come a time, I predict, when the majority in the US are not Christian, maybe not even religious at all.  If that majority were to vote to ban religion and/or Christianity, you'd better believe the Christians would be crying about their constitutional rights!  Here is a video of a 'conservative' lawyer making a Fox News anchor look dumb.  Notice that the anchor doesn't mention the 6.4 million who voted against the ban, but mentions the 7 million multiple times.  The lawyer does an incredibly good job here, very intelligent, very articulate.  But that doesn't excuse him for fighting for Bush in the 2000 election court cases. ;-)    (more commentary below the video)



5.  I saw a response from a black preacher, who made the points in #2, #3 and #4 before I stopped reading.  But the irony was not lost on me.  Hey you, black preacher!  Should we vote to move your black ass back to the back of the bus?  Should we ban you from our country clubs, schools and even water fountains?  What if we can get a majority vote on that?  Was it OK to keep blacks segregated when the majority thought it was OK?  Or was it always a violation of their civil rights?  Should we make it illegal for a white girl to marry you, like the laws of many states dictated in the 1960's?  Wait, don't answer that!  You'll talk when I tell you you can talk, boy!  Shut up and listen or go back to work on my cotton farm!  You're an ungrateful bastard who, once granted his civil rights, bails on everybody else who still doesn't have theirs.

6. One Christian said that the judge is forcing gay marriage on them.  I'm sorry, but I didn't see anybody forcing you to have a gay marriage.  It won't make even one bit of difference in the way you live your life.  Maybe if your dumb ass wasn't so concerned with what other people are doing in their personal lives, it wouldn't matter to you as much?

7.  Marriage died a long time ago, and has become virtually meaningless.  It is no longer a permanent thing, just something people try for a few years.  A lot of my friends and family members are at the age where they're getting married, and I've got to admit that when they tell me about it, I almost immediately think, "I wonder how long they'll last."  That's how dead marriage is.

8.  Christians are arguing that this ruling will eventually lead to polygamy.  Do they mean polygamy like in the Bible?  From the America's Best Christian, Betty Bowers, website:

3 comments:

Jim said...

What is very ironic about all of this, and I don't know how obvious this is to people who don't live here, is that these people claim that the majority voted, and that we should follow the majority vote.

However, when Al Gore was elected president, they didn't want to listen to the majority.

When people were polled and were shown to be heavily against the war in Iraq, they didn't want to listen to the majority.

When polls showed that Americans were in favor of a trial to impeach Bush, they didn't want to listen to the majority.

When polls showed that Americans do not want religion to play a part in American politics, they didn't want to listen to the majority.

When the majority of Americans voted for President Obama, they didn't want to listen to the majority.

Fact is, I can go on like this for a long long time.

The Christian right here is the most ignorant and ill-informed movement in this nation. And they make a majority in some key areas. Which is downright scary.

Now, I am an atheist. And I am married to a woman who believes in a god. And we are both for gay marriage. Why?

To us, marriage is not about being one before a god. Marriage is a way we con prove our dedication and love for each other. Nothing more complicated than that. If two people of any gender wish to display to the world their love and commitment for each other, then let them do so. Quit throwing your gods into our lives. We can make our own choices. We're all grown ups here.

ANTZILLA said...

Marriage is a religous thing.

What is needed is a non-religous marriage equalivlent. So Straight, Atheists as well as Gay people could have the benifits of marriage, without it being called marriage or have any affiliation to any religon.

If it wasn't for marriage and funnerals religions would have nowhere to push themselfs on everyone.

How many time does an atheist have heaps of religous crap at there funerals? No one invites it however its/there there as if it there right.
I've told my family and friends there is to be NO religous crap at my funeral.

Daniel said...

I have a superubermega catholic funeral tomorrow, where we will be forcefed a pile of crap about how she is in a better place and then talk about her life in a reflective way, interspersed with bible readings.
Instead of quietly mourning or respectful farewells, or in my case not going in because I don't do the whole talk to a corpse thing, we go and try to make ourselves feel better by being told she is going to the sugar daddy in the sky.
I don't mind reminiscing or whatever if/when (times are a'changing) I die, but I hate when people up all mournful then get totally blootered (really drunk) at the funeral party (oxymoron alert?).
I want my organs harvested and then buried in a low/no carbon manner, to feed the plants, and if there's a damn priest there I swear I'll drag him down with me.
p.s. Compulsary through school, I probably have to go to daddy bear's mass when he's in scotland.
rage